What games are just objective masterpieces?
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Just out of curiosity, listing the games mentioned here as of this writing by their date of release:
Release Date Game 1980 Pac-Man 1985 The Oregon Trail (assuming widely-played 1985 game) 1985 Tetris 1986 Kid Icarus 1988 Mega Man 2 1988 Super Mario Brothers 3 1988 The Guardian Legend 1989 Abadox: The Deadly Inner War 1989 Ironsword: Wizards & Warriors II 1989 Monster Party 1989 Populous 1989 Sweet Home 1990 Dr. Mario 1990 Final Fantasy III 1991 Battletoads (assuming original game) 1991 The Legend of Zelda: A Link to the Past 1992 Ecco the Dolphin 1992 Sonic the Hedgehog 2 1992 Super Mario Kart 1993 Dinopark Tycoon 1993 Doom 1993 Gauntlet IV 1993 Lufia & the Fortress of Doom (assuming first game) 1993 Mega Man X 1994 Donkey Kong Country 1994 Earthworm Jim 1994 Sonic & Knuckles 1994 Sonic the Hedgehog 3 1994 Super Metroid 1994 The Lion King 1995 Chrono Trigger 1997 Castlevania: Symphony of the Night 1997 Diablo 1997 Final Fantasy VII 1997 Mega Man X4 1997 Oddworld: Abe's Oddysee 1997 Snowboard Kids 1998 Banjo-Kazooie 1998 Metal Gear Solid 1998 Sonic Adventure 1998 South Park 1998 StarCraft: Brood War 1999 Age of Empires II: The Age of Kings 1999 Heroes of Might and Magic III 1999 Planescape: Torment 1999 Quake III Arena 1999 RollerCoaster Tycoon 1999 Silent Hill 1999 Street Fighter III: 3rd Strike 1999 Sven Co-op 1999 Unreal Tournament 1999 Worms Armageddon 2000 Command & Conquer: Red Alert 2 2000 Diablo II 2000 Resident Evil CODE: Veronica 2000 SimCity 3000 Unlimited 2000 Tony Hawk Pro Skater 2 2001 Ace Combat 04: Shattered Skies 2001 Final Fantasy X 2001 Metal Gear Solid 2: Sons of Liberty 2001 Shenmue II 2002 The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind 2003 Beyond Good & Evil 2003 Need for Speed: Underground 2003 Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic 2004 Ace Combat 5: The Unsung War 2004 Champions of Norrath 2004 Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas 2004 Gran Turismo 4 2004 Half Life 2 2004 Metal Gear Solid 3: Snake Eater 2004 The Legend of Zelda: The Minish Cap 2005 Champions: Return to Arms 2005 Psychonauts 2005 Shadow of the Colossus 2006 Ace Combat Zero: The Belkan War 2006 Ōkami 2007 BioShock 2007 Dark Souls 2007 Mass Effect 2007 Portal 2008 Clonk Rage 2008 Left 4 Dead 2008 Mirror's Edge 2008 Super Smash Bros. Brawl 2009 Dragon Age: Origins 2009 Forza Motorsport 3 2009 Killing Floor 2009 Left 4 Dead 2 2009 Plants vs. Zombies 2009 Steins;Gate 2010 Battlefield: Bad Company 2 2010 Limbo 2010 Nier 2010 Planet Minigolf 2011 Bastion 2011 Portal 2 2011 Terraria 2011 The Binding of Isaac 2012 Hotline Miami 2012 The House in Fata Morgana 2012 Tokyo Jungle 2014 Forza Horizon 2 2014 LISA: The Painful 2015 Bloodborne 2015 Ori and the Blind Forest 2015 The Witcher 3: Wild Hunt 2015 Undertale 2016 Doom (2016) 2016 Kirby: Planet Robobot 2016 Stardew Valley 2016 The Witness 2016 Titanfall 2 2016 Tyranny 2017 Little Nightmares 2017 Mario Kart 8 Deluxe (for Deluxe version) 2017 Nier: Automata 2017 Night in the Woods 2017 Super Mario Odyssey 2017 The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild 2018 Celeste 2018 Donut County 2018 Return of the Obra Dinn 2018 Rimworld 2018 Subnautica 2019 A Short Hike 2019 Disco Elysium 2019 Outer Wilds 2019 Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice 2019 Slay the Spire 2020 Cyberpunk 2077 2020 Factorio 2020 Hades 2021 Everhood: An Ineffable Tale of the Inexpressible Divine Moments of Truth 2021 Psychonauts 2 2022 Elden Ring 2022 Lil Gator Game 2023 Baldur's Gate 3 2023 Dave the Diver 2024 Balatro 1996: Duke Nukem 3D
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Honestly, many of them you know full well, but that's because yes, they are that good:
- Minecraft
- TES III Morrowind and TES V Skyrim
- The Witcher 1 and 3
- Deus Ex Human Revolution and Mankind Divided
- Cyberpunk 2077
- Dishonored 1 and 2
- Warcraft III and World of Warcraft
Completely deserve their legendary status
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Team Fortress 2
The best teamshooter game to date, endless copy cats that suck ass.
It does have a couple sore points. The whole aimbots running rampant was awful. And it was one of the first major games to introduce and popularize micro transactions.
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I feel like Soma was a decent metaphysical question wrapped in a okayish walking simulator.
It got a lot of praise, but basically boils down to the question "what makes you you" with nothing else about it standing out.
If the gameplay isn't a driving factor of making the game objectively good, then I don't think it counts.
The lack of gameplay is fine, and very much important to call out for any new players. There's a whole genre of "you're playing a movie" that SOMA fits nicely into
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Chromehounds was the greatest mech game on shitbox 360 and you can't change my mind.
The sheer variety in player created metas was glorious to behold. Sure, you could play how the game encouraged you to play and hang your weapons in "normal" configurations. But you could also bury whole teams in indirect fire with a triple double from across the map. You could build a little punchy boi buggy with a dick piston, cockpit, wheels, and nothing else. You could even try to sweat the meta in the chicken leg howitzer or the turtle up in the armored crab.
The only limits were creativity and spacer availability lmfaooo
It's pretty wack that we haven't since had a game that captures many of the better elements of Chrome hounds.
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Okay, now do it all on a bell curve.
What's the most absolute medium game, to which all other games are compared to, and if worse, fail, or are better and pass?
Hell I'd make that a separate post!
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I'm always curious why people add things like Ocarina of Time to lists like these. While the game was revolutionary at the time, I don't think it holds up particularly well nor succeeds where later zeldas fail.
To call it an objective masterpiece I feel like it has to be a game that someone picking up today would still enjoy and appreciate. Tetris and Portal for example hold up well even by today's standards.
The thing that not holds well in Ocarina of Time is the N64 controls and like what they supposed to do to overcome that?
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Just out of curiosity, listing the games mentioned here as of this writing by their date of release:
Release Date Game 1980 Pac-Man 1985 The Oregon Trail (assuming widely-played 1985 game) 1985 Tetris 1986 Kid Icarus 1988 Mega Man 2 1988 Super Mario Brothers 3 1988 The Guardian Legend 1989 Abadox: The Deadly Inner War 1989 Ironsword: Wizards & Warriors II 1989 Monster Party 1989 Populous 1989 Sweet Home 1990 Dr. Mario 1990 Final Fantasy III 1991 Battletoads (assuming original game) 1991 The Legend of Zelda: A Link to the Past 1992 Ecco the Dolphin 1992 Sonic the Hedgehog 2 1992 Super Mario Kart 1993 Dinopark Tycoon 1993 Doom 1993 Gauntlet IV 1993 Lufia & the Fortress of Doom (assuming first game) 1993 Mega Man X 1994 Donkey Kong Country 1994 Earthworm Jim 1994 Sonic & Knuckles 1994 Sonic the Hedgehog 3 1994 Super Metroid 1994 The Lion King 1995 Chrono Trigger 1997 Castlevania: Symphony of the Night 1997 Diablo 1997 Final Fantasy VII 1997 Mega Man X4 1997 Oddworld: Abe's Oddysee 1997 Snowboard Kids 1998 Banjo-Kazooie 1998 Metal Gear Solid 1998 Sonic Adventure 1998 South Park 1998 StarCraft: Brood War 1999 Age of Empires II: The Age of Kings 1999 Heroes of Might and Magic III 1999 Planescape: Torment 1999 Quake III Arena 1999 RollerCoaster Tycoon 1999 Silent Hill 1999 Street Fighter III: 3rd Strike 1999 Sven Co-op 1999 Unreal Tournament 1999 Worms Armageddon 2000 Command & Conquer: Red Alert 2 2000 Diablo II 2000 Resident Evil CODE: Veronica 2000 SimCity 3000 Unlimited 2000 Tony Hawk Pro Skater 2 2001 Ace Combat 04: Shattered Skies 2001 Final Fantasy X 2001 Metal Gear Solid 2: Sons of Liberty 2001 Shenmue II 2002 The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind 2003 Beyond Good & Evil 2003 Need for Speed: Underground 2003 Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic 2004 Ace Combat 5: The Unsung War 2004 Champions of Norrath 2004 Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas 2004 Gran Turismo 4 2004 Half Life 2 2004 Metal Gear Solid 3: Snake Eater 2004 The Legend of Zelda: The Minish Cap 2005 Champions: Return to Arms 2005 Psychonauts 2005 Shadow of the Colossus 2006 Ace Combat Zero: The Belkan War 2006 Ōkami 2007 BioShock 2007 Dark Souls 2007 Mass Effect 2007 Portal 2008 Clonk Rage 2008 Left 4 Dead 2008 Mirror's Edge 2008 Super Smash Bros. Brawl 2009 Dragon Age: Origins 2009 Forza Motorsport 3 2009 Killing Floor 2009 Left 4 Dead 2 2009 Plants vs. Zombies 2009 Steins;Gate 2010 Battlefield: Bad Company 2 2010 Limbo 2010 Nier 2010 Planet Minigolf 2011 Bastion 2011 Portal 2 2011 Terraria 2011 The Binding of Isaac 2012 Hotline Miami 2012 The House in Fata Morgana 2012 Tokyo Jungle 2014 Forza Horizon 2 2014 LISA: The Painful 2015 Bloodborne 2015 Ori and the Blind Forest 2015 The Witcher 3: Wild Hunt 2015 Undertale 2016 Doom (2016) 2016 Kirby: Planet Robobot 2016 Stardew Valley 2016 The Witness 2016 Titanfall 2 2016 Tyranny 2017 Little Nightmares 2017 Mario Kart 8 Deluxe (for Deluxe version) 2017 Nier: Automata 2017 Night in the Woods 2017 Super Mario Odyssey 2017 The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild 2018 Celeste 2018 Donut County 2018 Return of the Obra Dinn 2018 Rimworld 2018 Subnautica 2019 A Short Hike 2019 Disco Elysium 2019 Outer Wilds 2019 Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice 2019 Slay the Spire 2020 Cyberpunk 2077 2020 Factorio 2020 Hades 2021 Everhood: An Ineffable Tale of the Inexpressible Divine Moments of Truth 2021 Psychonauts 2 2022 Elden Ring 2022 Lil Gator Game 2023 Baldur's Gate 3 2023 Dave the Diver 2024 Balatro The only game I kinda like on this list is Okami.
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Well, none because favorites are super subjective, but I'll shout out my favorites because no one else did:
- The Wonderful 101
- Bayonetta
- Ninja Gaiden II
- God Hand
- Viewtiful Joe
- Catherine
- Gravity Rush
- Guilty Gear XX Accent Core Plus R
- Under Night In-Birth II Sys:Celes
- Persona 4 Arena Ultimax
- Crimzon Clover: World EXplosion
- Ketsui: Kizuna Jigoku Tachi
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The thing that not holds well in Ocarina of Time is the N64 controls and like what they supposed to do to overcome that?
It's probably me being pedantic, but for an "objective masterpiece" the game needs to stand on its own and not on its legacy. I just don't think Ocarina of Time holds up to later zelda games in many aspects (although I do think the story and soundtrack do).
Generally I think the ps1 and N64 era just suffer from the transition to 3D. Graphically and gameplay wise many games suffered for being the first foray into 3D gaming and those challenges wouldn't really be settled until the next generation.
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Well, none because favorites are super subjective, but I'll shout out my favorites because no one else did:
- The Wonderful 101
- Bayonetta
- Ninja Gaiden II
- God Hand
- Viewtiful Joe
- Catherine
- Gravity Rush
- Guilty Gear XX Accent Core Plus R
- Under Night In-Birth II Sys:Celes
- Persona 4 Arena Ultimax
- Crimzon Clover: World EXplosion
- Ketsui: Kizuna Jigoku Tachi
Catherine deserves to be on someone's list so glad you have it and Gravity rush is a good choice cause it was a fun use of mechanics.
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- Portal 1/2 of course.
- Grim Fandango. (Flawed yes, but absolutely a masterpiece)
- Psychonauts.
- Fallout New Vegas.
- System Shock (the original).
- The Longest Journey.
- Mass Effect. Maybe.
Portal 1 & 2 were the first to my mind as well. I really like this list, actually.
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SOMA was great
I've been craving another experience like SOMA but unfortunately nothing even comes close. It was probably the coolest and most disturbing story I've ever seen. Finishing that game gave me an existential crisis for like 2 days after. It was that good.
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I feel like Soma was a decent metaphysical question wrapped in a okayish walking simulator.
It got a lot of praise, but basically boils down to the question "what makes you you" with nothing else about it standing out.
If the gameplay isn't a driving factor of making the game objectively good, then I don't think it counts.
Personally I think story can make a game stand out far more than graphics or gameplay. I also disagree that the game boiled down to one question. While it was the primary focus of the narrative, the underwater laboratories and world building/history was amazing.
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Portal 1 & 2 were the first to my mind as well. I really like this list, actually.
Glad to hear it.
I'm tempted to add Red Dead Redemption 2 to the list, but it's too new for me to decide yet.
I think it belongs. It was the greatest storytelling game I've played in a decade or more.
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The lack of gameplay is fine, and very much important to call out for any new players. There's a whole genre of "you're playing a movie" that SOMA fits nicely into
wrote last edited by [email protected]I think a masterpiece game has to offer more than just story. Additionally I think something like Firewatch does a much better job at telling a compelling story for a walking simulator. But clearly this is why "objective" masterpiece is hard to define, as nothing is really objective in these opinions.
Other games I'd consider better in the walking simulator category:
- Unfinished Swan
- Firewatch
- Gone Home
- Stanley Parable
Edit: Fixed formatting
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Personally I think story can make a game stand out far more than graphics or gameplay. I also disagree that the game boiled down to one question. While it was the primary focus of the narrative, the underwater laboratories and world building/history was amazing.
I don't disagree, but my opinion is gameplay (or the interactive nature) of games is what sets them apart from other mediums so would be a deciding factor in a masterpiece game.
But I guess it largely just boils down to the fact Soma just didn't do much for me.
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It does have a couple sore points. The whole aimbots running rampant was awful. And it was one of the first major games to introduce and popularize micro transactions.
Both true points, however Its still my favorite game of all time. To be fair I am a fanboy, my steam year in review last year was 99% TF2. I don't really play any other games besides tf2 still.
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I'd say :
- The first Deus Ex and its first prequel Human Revolution
- Mafia I
- Max Payne 1 and 3
- Crash Bandicoot 1
- Age of Empires II
- GTA III
- Doom 1/2
- First Half-Life
- First Unreal
- Doom 3
- Duke Nukem 3D
- Morrowind
- Skyrim (modded and fixed, vanilla is pure garbage)
- Blood Omen 1
- Silent Hill 1 and 2
- Resident Evil 1 and 4 (and their remakes)
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Nobody can answer that question objectively.
