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  3. What games are just objective masterpieces?

What games are just objective masterpieces?

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  • J jacksilver@lemmy.world
    29 May 2025, 22:10

    I feel like Soma was a decent metaphysical question wrapped in a okayish walking simulator.

    It got a lot of praise, but basically boils down to the question "what makes you you" with nothing else about it standing out.

    If the gameplay isn't a driving factor of making the game objectively good, then I don't think it counts.

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    mintyant@lemmy.world
    wrote on 29 May 2025, 22:46 last edited by
    #254

    The lack of gameplay is fine, and very much important to call out for any new players. There's a whole genre of "you're playing a movie" that SOMA fits nicely into

    J 1 Reply Last reply 30 May 2025, 04:46
    2
    • L lordgimp@lemm.ee
      29 May 2025, 02:04

      Chromehounds was the greatest mech game on shitbox 360 and you can't change my mind.

      The sheer variety in player created metas was glorious to behold. Sure, you could play how the game encouraged you to play and hang your weapons in "normal" configurations. But you could also bury whole teams in indirect fire with a triple double from across the map. You could build a little punchy boi buggy with a dick piston, cockpit, wheels, and nothing else. You could even try to sweat the meta in the chicken leg howitzer or the turtle up in the armored crab.

      The only limits were creativity and spacer availability lmfaooo

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      mintyant@lemmy.world
      wrote on 29 May 2025, 22:47 last edited by
      #255

      It's pretty wack that we haven't since had a game that captures many of the better elements of Chrome hounds.

      1 Reply Last reply
      0
      • S scmstr@lemmy.blahaj.zone
        29 May 2025, 18:21

        Okay, now do it all on a bell curve.

        What's the most absolute medium game, to which all other games are compared to, and if worse, fail, or are better and pass?

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        weirdbeardgame@lemmy.world
        wrote on 29 May 2025, 22:50 last edited by
        #256

        Hell I'd make that a separate post!

        1 Reply Last reply
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        • J jacksilver@lemmy.world
          29 May 2025, 22:16

          I'm always curious why people add things like Ocarina of Time to lists like these. While the game was revolutionary at the time, I don't think it holds up particularly well nor succeeds where later zeldas fail.

          To call it an objective masterpiece I feel like it has to be a game that someone picking up today would still enjoy and appreciate. Tetris and Portal for example hold up well even by today's standards.

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          zerohora@lemmy.ml
          wrote on 29 May 2025, 22:53 last edited by
          #257

          The thing that not holds well in Ocarina of Time is the N64 controls and like what they supposed to do to overcome that?

          J 1 Reply Last reply 30 May 2025, 00:07
          1
          • T tal@lemmy.today
            28 May 2025, 01:45

            Just out of curiosity, listing the games mentioned here as of this writing by their date of release:

            Release Date Game
            1980 Pac-Man
            1985 The Oregon Trail (assuming widely-played 1985 game)
            1985 Tetris
            1986 Kid Icarus
            1988 Mega Man 2
            1988 Super Mario Brothers 3
            1988 The Guardian Legend
            1989 Abadox: The Deadly Inner War
            1989 Ironsword: Wizards & Warriors II
            1989 Monster Party
            1989 Populous
            1989 Sweet Home
            1990 Dr. Mario
            1990 Final Fantasy III
            1991 Battletoads (assuming original game)
            1991 The Legend of Zelda: A Link to the Past
            1992 Ecco the Dolphin
            1992 Sonic the Hedgehog 2
            1992 Super Mario Kart
            1993 Dinopark Tycoon
            1993 Doom
            1993 Gauntlet IV
            1993 Lufia & the Fortress of Doom (assuming first game)
            1993 Mega Man X
            1994 Donkey Kong Country
            1994 Earthworm Jim
            1994 Sonic & Knuckles
            1994 Sonic the Hedgehog 3
            1994 Super Metroid
            1994 The Lion King
            1995 Chrono Trigger
            1997 Castlevania: Symphony of the Night
            1997 Diablo
            1997 Final Fantasy VII
            1997 Mega Man X4
            1997 Oddworld: Abe's Oddysee
            1997 Snowboard Kids
            1998 Banjo-Kazooie
            1998 Metal Gear Solid
            1998 Sonic Adventure
            1998 South Park
            1998 StarCraft: Brood War
            1999 Age of Empires II: The Age of Kings
            1999 Heroes of Might and Magic III
            1999 Planescape: Torment
            1999 Quake III Arena
            1999 RollerCoaster Tycoon
            1999 Silent Hill
            1999 Street Fighter III: 3rd Strike
            1999 Sven Co-op
            1999 Unreal Tournament
            1999 Worms Armageddon
            2000 Command & Conquer: Red Alert 2
            2000 Diablo II
            2000 Resident Evil CODE: Veronica
            2000 SimCity 3000 Unlimited
            2000 Tony Hawk Pro Skater 2
            2001 Ace Combat 04: Shattered Skies
            2001 Final Fantasy X
            2001 Metal Gear Solid 2: Sons of Liberty
            2001 Shenmue II
            2002 The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind
            2003 Beyond Good & Evil
            2003 Need for Speed: Underground
            2003 Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic
            2004 Ace Combat 5: The Unsung War
            2004 Champions of Norrath
            2004 Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas
            2004 Gran Turismo 4
            2004 Half Life 2
            2004 Metal Gear Solid 3: Snake Eater
            2004 The Legend of Zelda: The Minish Cap
            2005 Champions: Return to Arms
            2005 Psychonauts
            2005 Shadow of the Colossus
            2006 Ace Combat Zero: The Belkan War
            2006 ÅŒkami
            2007 BioShock
            2007 Dark Souls
            2007 Mass Effect
            2007 Portal
            2008 Clonk Rage
            2008 Left 4 Dead
            2008 Mirror's Edge
            2008 Super Smash Bros. Brawl
            2009 Dragon Age: Origins
            2009 Forza Motorsport 3
            2009 Killing Floor
            2009 Left 4 Dead 2
            2009 Plants vs. Zombies
            2009 Steins;Gate
            2010 Battlefield: Bad Company 2
            2010 Limbo
            2010 Nier
            2010 Planet Minigolf
            2011 Bastion
            2011 Portal 2
            2011 Terraria
            2011 The Binding of Isaac
            2012 Hotline Miami
            2012 The House in Fata Morgana
            2012 Tokyo Jungle
            2014 Forza Horizon 2
            2014 LISA: The Painful
            2015 Bloodborne
            2015 Ori and the Blind Forest
            2015 The Witcher 3: Wild Hunt
            2015 Undertale
            2016 Doom (2016)
            2016 Kirby: Planet Robobot
            2016 Stardew Valley
            2016 The Witness
            2016 Titanfall 2
            2016 Tyranny
            2017 Little Nightmares
            2017 Mario Kart 8 Deluxe (for Deluxe version)
            2017 Nier: Automata
            2017 Night in the Woods
            2017 Super Mario Odyssey
            2017 The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild
            2018 Celeste
            2018 Donut County
            2018 Return of the Obra Dinn
            2018 Rimworld
            2018 Subnautica
            2019 A Short Hike
            2019 Disco Elysium
            2019 Outer Wilds
            2019 Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice
            2019 Slay the Spire
            2020 Cyberpunk 2077
            2020 Factorio
            2020 Hades
            2021 Everhood: An Ineffable Tale of the Inexpressible Divine Moments of Truth
            2021 Psychonauts 2
            2022 Elden Ring
            2022 Lil Gator Game
            2023 Baldur's Gate 3
            2023 Dave the Diver
            2024 Balatro
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            mohab@piefed.social
            wrote on 29 May 2025, 23:17 last edited by
            #258

            The only game I kinda like on this list is Okami.

            1 Reply Last reply
            0
            • W weirdbeardgame@lemmy.world
              27 May 2025, 22:30
              This post did not contain any content.
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              mohab@piefed.social
              wrote on 29 May 2025, 23:22 last edited by
              #259

              Well, none because favorites are super subjective, but I'll shout out my favorites because no one else did:

              1. The Wonderful 101
              2. Bayonetta
              3. Ninja Gaiden II
              4. God Hand
              5. Viewtiful Joe
              6. Catherine
              7. Gravity Rush
              8. Guilty Gear XX Accent Core Plus R
              9. Under Night In-Birth II Sys:Celes
              10. Persona 4 Arena Ultimax
              11. Crimzon Clover: World EXplosion
              12. Ketsui: Kizuna Jigoku Tachi
              K 1 Reply Last reply 30 May 2025, 00:30
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              • Z zerohora@lemmy.ml
                29 May 2025, 22:53

                The thing that not holds well in Ocarina of Time is the N64 controls and like what they supposed to do to overcome that?

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                jacksilver@lemmy.world
                wrote on 30 May 2025, 00:07 last edited by
                #260

                It's probably me being pedantic, but for an "objective masterpiece" the game needs to stand on its own and not on its legacy. I just don't think Ocarina of Time holds up to later zelda games in many aspects (although I do think the story and soundtrack do).

                Generally I think the ps1 and N64 era just suffer from the transition to 3D. Graphically and gameplay wise many games suffered for being the first foray into 3D gaming and those challenges wouldn't really be settled until the next generation.

                1 Reply Last reply
                1
                • M mohab@piefed.social
                  29 May 2025, 23:22

                  Well, none because favorites are super subjective, but I'll shout out my favorites because no one else did:

                  1. The Wonderful 101
                  2. Bayonetta
                  3. Ninja Gaiden II
                  4. God Hand
                  5. Viewtiful Joe
                  6. Catherine
                  7. Gravity Rush
                  8. Guilty Gear XX Accent Core Plus R
                  9. Under Night In-Birth II Sys:Celes
                  10. Persona 4 Arena Ultimax
                  11. Crimzon Clover: World EXplosion
                  12. Ketsui: Kizuna Jigoku Tachi
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                  krauerking@lemy.lol
                  wrote on 30 May 2025, 00:30 last edited by
                  #261

                  Catherine deserves to be on someone's list so glad you have it and Gravity rush is a good choice cause it was a fun use of mechanics.

                  1 Reply Last reply
                  0
                  • S swordgeek@lemmy.ca
                    29 May 2025, 20:21
                    • Portal 1/2 of course.
                    • Grim Fandango. (Flawed yes, but absolutely a masterpiece)
                    • Psychonauts.
                    • Fallout New Vegas.
                    • System Shock (the original).
                    • The Longest Journey.
                    • Mass Effect. Maybe.
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                    fpslem@lemmy.world
                    wrote on 30 May 2025, 01:30 last edited by
                    #262

                    Portal 1 & 2 were the first to my mind as well. I really like this list, actually.

                    S 1 Reply Last reply 30 May 2025, 04:39
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                    • K kinther@lemmy.world
                      29 May 2025, 18:43

                      SOMA was great

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                      feelzgoodman420@eviltoast.org
                      wrote on 30 May 2025, 03:15 last edited by
                      #263

                      I've been craving another experience like SOMA but unfortunately nothing even comes close. It was probably the coolest and most disturbing story I've ever seen. Finishing that game gave me an existential crisis for like 2 days after. It was that good.

                      1 Reply Last reply
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                      • J jacksilver@lemmy.world
                        29 May 2025, 22:10

                        I feel like Soma was a decent metaphysical question wrapped in a okayish walking simulator.

                        It got a lot of praise, but basically boils down to the question "what makes you you" with nothing else about it standing out.

                        If the gameplay isn't a driving factor of making the game objectively good, then I don't think it counts.

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                        kinther@lemmy.world
                        wrote on 30 May 2025, 03:22 last edited by
                        #264

                        Personally I think story can make a game stand out far more than graphics or gameplay. I also disagree that the game boiled down to one question. While it was the primary focus of the narrative, the underwater laboratories and world building/history was amazing.

                        J 1 Reply Last reply 30 May 2025, 04:54
                        1
                        • F fpslem@lemmy.world
                          30 May 2025, 01:30

                          Portal 1 & 2 were the first to my mind as well. I really like this list, actually.

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                          swordgeek@lemmy.ca
                          wrote on 30 May 2025, 04:39 last edited by
                          #265

                          Glad to hear it.

                          I'm tempted to add Red Dead Redemption 2 to the list, but it's too new for me to decide yet.

                          I think it belongs. It was the greatest storytelling game I've played in a decade or more.

                          1 Reply Last reply
                          0
                          • M mintyant@lemmy.world
                            29 May 2025, 22:46

                            The lack of gameplay is fine, and very much important to call out for any new players. There's a whole genre of "you're playing a movie" that SOMA fits nicely into

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                            jacksilver@lemmy.world
                            wrote on 30 May 2025, 04:46 last edited by jacksilver@lemmy.world
                            #266

                            I think a masterpiece game has to offer more than just story. Additionally I think something like Firewatch does a much better job at telling a compelling story for a walking simulator. But clearly this is why "objective" masterpiece is hard to define, as nothing is really objective in these opinions.

                            Other games I'd consider better in the walking simulator category:

                            • Unfinished Swan
                            • Firewatch
                            • Gone Home
                            • Stanley Parable

                            Edit: Fixed formatting

                            1 Reply Last reply
                            0
                            • K kinther@lemmy.world
                              30 May 2025, 03:22

                              Personally I think story can make a game stand out far more than graphics or gameplay. I also disagree that the game boiled down to one question. While it was the primary focus of the narrative, the underwater laboratories and world building/history was amazing.

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                              jacksilver@lemmy.world
                              wrote on 30 May 2025, 04:54 last edited by
                              #267

                              I don't disagree, but my opinion is gameplay (or the interactive nature) of games is what sets them apart from other mediums so would be a deciding factor in a masterpiece game.

                              But I guess it largely just boils down to the fact Soma just didn't do much for me.

                              F 1 Reply Last reply 3 Jun 2025, 21:31
                              0
                              • M mintyant@lemmy.world
                                29 May 2025, 22:44

                                It does have a couple sore points. The whole aimbots running rampant was awful. And it was one of the first major games to introduce and popularize micro transactions.

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                                zetta@mander.xyz
                                wrote on 30 May 2025, 12:36 last edited by
                                #268

                                Both true points, however Its still my favorite game of all time. To be fair I am a fanboy, my steam year in review last year was 99% TF2. I don't really play any other games besides tf2 still.

                                1 Reply Last reply
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                                • W weirdbeardgame@lemmy.world
                                  27 May 2025, 22:30
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                                  subject106@jlai.lu
                                  wrote on 30 May 2025, 20:55 last edited by subject106@jlai.lu
                                  #269

                                  I'd say :

                                  • The first Deus Ex and its first prequel Human Revolution
                                  • Mafia I
                                  • Max Payne 1 and 3
                                  • Crash Bandicoot 1
                                  • Age of Empires II
                                  • GTA III
                                  • Doom 1/2
                                  • First Half-Life
                                  • First Unreal
                                  • Doom 3
                                  • Duke Nukem 3D
                                  • Morrowind
                                  • Skyrim (modded and fixed, vanilla is pure garbage)
                                  • Blood Omen 1
                                  • Silent Hill 1 and 2
                                  • Resident Evil 1 and 4 (and their remakes)
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                                  0
                                  • W weirdbeardgame@lemmy.world
                                    27 May 2025, 22:30
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                                    _cryptagion@lemmy.dbzer0.com
                                    wrote on 30 May 2025, 21:47 last edited by
                                    #270

                                    Nobody can answer that question objectively.

                                    1 Reply Last reply
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                                    • M mutat0@lemm.ee
                                      29 May 2025, 21:28

                                      I love that you included 1.6. I spent my all teenage years staying up all night playing this. I was thinking single player epics but this is absolutely a masterpiece.

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                                      msage@programming.dev
                                      wrote on 30 May 2025, 22:30 last edited by
                                      #271

                                      Yeah, me too... man, I would play 16+ hours on some weekends... I was kinda good, too. Too young, but godly reflexes. I still think about those days sometimes...

                                      M 1 Reply Last reply 31 May 2025, 00:19
                                      0
                                      • M msage@programming.dev
                                        30 May 2025, 22:30

                                        Yeah, me too... man, I would play 16+ hours on some weekends... I was kinda good, too. Too young, but godly reflexes. I still think about those days sometimes...

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                                        mutat0@lemm.ee
                                        wrote on 31 May 2025, 00:19 last edited by
                                        #272

                                        I'll sit and watch old matches from of semi finals from 2004. Every round. I can't get enough of the strategy and presicion. I'm so grateful for the memories and friends but also sad because, how do you replicate an era like that? A game that perfect? ESEA, HLTV demos, frag movies, forums. It was the best man.

                                        1 Reply Last reply
                                        1
                                        • J jacksilver@lemmy.world
                                          30 May 2025, 04:54

                                          I don't disagree, but my opinion is gameplay (or the interactive nature) of games is what sets them apart from other mediums so would be a deciding factor in a masterpiece game.

                                          But I guess it largely just boils down to the fact Soma just didn't do much for me.

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                                          feelzgoodman420@eviltoast.org
                                          wrote on 3 Jun 2025, 21:31 last edited by feelzgoodman420@eviltoast.org 6 Mar 2025, 17:33
                                          #273

                                          I'd recommend playing SOMA again, but this time get extremely baked before you play. I'm joking (not really) but I found that game's story so profound and interesting. It was like the most twisted unsettling environment I've ever seen. It had basic walking sim mechanics but being able to explore the environment and look at things up close was just really enjoyable.

                                          Also, I Inverse Tonemapped the game from SDR to HDR, so while not the best use of HDR, the added contrast gave the game a more pleasing spooky vibe. I also ran it at 4x DLDSR so it was very sharp.

                                          J 1 Reply Last reply 3 Jun 2025, 22:50
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