Had a take about Supergiant Games that recieved a lot of pushback fromy two longest running best friends.
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"I wish Supergiant would get the roguelite bug out of their system and make sequels to Bastion and then Transistor finally."
Was what I typed in our group chat. The three of us are mid to late 30s with me being the oldest by 3 months.
To say it went over like a brick balloon would be an understatement. So, I wanted to see if fellow game players had thoughts on it. Am I crazy? Do you agree?
I have the exact same take, and the exact same experience with my friend group. I love supergiant games. Anything they touch is solid gold imo. I've always said that Hades is an amazing game, it's just supergiant's worst game.
Personally, I think for me, it comes down to the setting. Bastion, Transistor and Pyre all had amazing, unique settings that made me as a player want to learn and explore everything I could. And again, Hades does an amazing job of painting the setting and fleshing out the characters, but it's kinda just Greek mythology, which has been done before and I personally find it less interesting.
To restate, Hades is an amazing game, just imo it's supergiants worst game.
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"I wish Supergiant would get the roguelite bug out of their system and make sequels to Bastion and then Transistor finally."
Was what I typed in our group chat. The three of us are mid to late 30s with me being the oldest by 3 months.
To say it went over like a brick balloon would be an understatement. So, I wanted to see if fellow game players had thoughts on it. Am I crazy? Do you agree?
As a long time SGG fan i agree. Personally im sad we're getting a hades 2.
Bastion and Transistor absolutely don't need sequels though
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"I wish Supergiant would get the roguelite bug out of their system and make sequels to Bastion and then Transistor finally."
Was what I typed in our group chat. The three of us are mid to late 30s with me being the oldest by 3 months.
To say it went over like a brick balloon would be an understatement. So, I wanted to see if fellow game players had thoughts on it. Am I crazy? Do you agree?
I agree, but mostly because I dislike roguelikes. They get too repetitive and turn into a slog, and the success of your runs is often entirely dependent on which items you find.
I’d much rather have a tight, concise game with handmade maps. IME, roguelikes just pull the old NES/SNES trick of “well we can’t fit more data on the game cart, so just make the game harder to force players to replay it over and over again. That will artificially inflate the game length.”
Bastion and Transistor don’t need sequels, but I do wish they’d stop with the roguelikes.
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I watched this video a while back. Apparently, they were looking to develop a universe that they could make a sequel in. They ended up with Hades.
I sadly have little interest in watching things about Hades as because I am so burnt out from asking for accessibility assistance (I actually think I did it multiple times in case they didn't catch it) and I am just frustrated with them as a whole and this post reignited it. But I am glad that they got what they wanted because Greek mythology is expansive. I think someone else will be happy about it. I just think I realized I feel relatively "done" with the company as a whole =/!
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I honestly preferred no sequls, everytime something new. I haven't played pyre and hades 2. While I liked hades, I was a bit sad when I heard hades 2, instead of something new.
I'm not an expert, but money (sales) is probably the reason. How many of their previous games sold vs Hades.
Also, maybe it's a bit cynnical to think of it this way, but hades 2 would require much less effort compared to making something new and it will churn sales as the first one has been a success. Additionally, they probably already had good idea and materials for additions to hades. So why not make hades 2 out of them. Maybe after that they will work on something new.
There can be a tricky balance between building sequels or something new. Sometimes there is more you can do in a world, and people enjoy returning to worlds when there is good reason to.
I think the recent Doom reboot trilogy is a masterclass example. Not everyone enjoys each game, people often have different favorites. But the point is they’re all Doom and yet id Software did something unique with each one. New mechanics, new ways to play, pushing boundaries of what came before.
Of course, with Greek mythology, there is plenty more source material to explore and build on in a setting like Hades. They certainly hit a great formula to do it, and The People
were clamoring for it. But with SG’s established preferences for going after new ideas instead of sequels, I wouldn’t be surprised to see them do something else after Hades 2. Or who knows, maybe they’ll be able to grow enough to work on multiple games at once. That could come with its own challenges, but plenty of studios have done it. -
I agree, but mostly because I dislike roguelikes. They get too repetitive and turn into a slog, and the success of your runs is often entirely dependent on which items you find.
I’d much rather have a tight, concise game with handmade maps. IME, roguelikes just pull the old NES/SNES trick of “well we can’t fit more data on the game cart, so just make the game harder to force players to replay it over and over again. That will artificially inflate the game length.”
Bastion and Transistor don’t need sequels, but I do wish they’d stop with the roguelikes.
I dislike roguelikes and soulslikes. It feels like that cuts out the vast majority of indie games being made nowadays.
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Yeah I say let them cook. Their "worst" game is Pyre (iirc it really didn't sell well) and it's still a very good game.
I really wanted to like it more because they made some really cool choices in the design of it. I can see why it didn't sell well, but it should have at least been more influential
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"I wish Supergiant would get the roguelite bug out of their system and make sequels to Bastion and then Transistor finally."
Was what I typed in our group chat. The three of us are mid to late 30s with me being the oldest by 3 months.
To say it went over like a brick balloon would be an understatement. So, I wanted to see if fellow game players had thoughts on it. Am I crazy? Do you agree?
I never finished bastion but I really liked it. I should replay it
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I never finished bastion but I really liked it. I should replay it
You really should.
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Bastion, Transistor, and Pyre 100% do not need a sequel. They are stories about the end of the world and are beautiful in how self contained they are.
I am not the biggest on the roguelike mechanics for such story heavy games but... I would be lying if I said that Hades didn't repeatedly break me with the way it was used to convey Zagreus's relationship with the other characters.
::: spoiler spoiler
Hades just putting down his weapon and letting you pass is easily one of my top ten of all time gaming moments.
:::I am a bit skeptical on Hades 2. Then I remembered I was skeptical on Hades 1. As far as I am concerned, Supergiant (and Greg Kasavin) can do no wrong.
I understand the skepticism, but Hades 2 is pretty fantastic, in my opinion. It does a lot to distinguish itself while still retaining what made the first one fun. I've got a little less than 200 hours in both of them.
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I have the exact same take, and the exact same experience with my friend group. I love supergiant games. Anything they touch is solid gold imo. I've always said that Hades is an amazing game, it's just supergiant's worst game.
Personally, I think for me, it comes down to the setting. Bastion, Transistor and Pyre all had amazing, unique settings that made me as a player want to learn and explore everything I could. And again, Hades does an amazing job of painting the setting and fleshing out the characters, but it's kinda just Greek mythology, which has been done before and I personally find it less interesting.
To restate, Hades is an amazing game, just imo it's supergiants worst game.
Wouldn’t pyre be the worst by sales numbers?
I think your bias against roguelike’s is showing here.Hades is massively popular and well liked by a lot of people.
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I agree, but mostly because I dislike roguelikes. They get too repetitive and turn into a slog, and the success of your runs is often entirely dependent on which items you find.
I’d much rather have a tight, concise game with handmade maps. IME, roguelikes just pull the old NES/SNES trick of “well we can’t fit more data on the game cart, so just make the game harder to force players to replay it over and over again. That will artificially inflate the game length.”
Bastion and Transistor don’t need sequels, but I do wish they’d stop with the roguelikes.
Thats really not what roguelikes are. They wouldnt be one of the most popular genres ever if the base was laziness. Its more like being able to focus fully on the mechaincs/gameplay instead of spending countless hours designing worlds that either end up feeling repetitive anyway or you need to spend another few chunks of countless hours to make it feel good.
Besides, Hades is by faaaaaar their most successful game, it would be objectively stupid not to keep going with that at least for a while.
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Be careful what you wish for, they could start making Vampire Survivor likes!
Maybe they should, the genre has potential, just look at Deep Rock Survivor
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I think I'm just getting sick of rogue likes. It seems there is another one being pushed every time I open steam. I find them all way too similar and frankly the loop of roguelikes is annoying to me. So, I would like to see them develop something else, I don't see it happening.
Hades was good. Rogue legacy was good. Dead cells was good. Brotato was good. Vampire survivors was good. Wizard of legend was good. Star of Providence was good. After those, though, I hit a wall. So, overall I agree. I wish the industry would move away from the genre, but it's not happening anytime soon.
Have you played Binding of Isaac though? The king of roguelikes
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Wouldn’t pyre be the worst by sales numbers?
I think your bias against roguelike’s is showing here.Hades is massively popular and well liked by a lot of people.
I love roguelikes, probably one of my favorite genres, so much so that I started playing rogue for a while to see what the OG was like.
And by sales numbers, 100% Pyre would be their worst game, but I'm far past judging a games content by its sales at this point.
And it's easy to see why Hades is loved by so many, it's a great game! Just definitely my least favorite of all of Supergiant's stuff.
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"I wish Supergiant would get the roguelite bug out of their system and make sequels to Bastion and then Transistor finally."
Was what I typed in our group chat. The three of us are mid to late 30s with me being the oldest by 3 months.
To say it went over like a brick balloon would be an understatement. So, I wanted to see if fellow game players had thoughts on it. Am I crazy? Do you agree?
wrote last edited by [email protected]Why would anyone have that strong a view about what you said...? I'm not clamouring for sequels particularly for those games, though I'd love more games like them. Then again, whatever gets me more beautiful soundtracks from Darren Korb.
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Why would anyone have that strong a view about what you said...? I'm not clamouring for sequels particularly for those games, though I'd love more games like them. Then again, whatever gets me more beautiful soundtracks from Darren Korb.
wrote last edited by [email protected]Because that first sentence sounds like a diss on Hades.
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I strongly disagree on their roguelite "bug" being something they need to drop.
Bastion didn't land for me, so I didn't play it, but Transistor would have shined as a roguelite. Its combat system is far too complex, and has potential for so much more, than what can be explored in one or two playthroughs.
The same goes for Cloudbank as a narrative setting.
Transistor, but with Hades' gameplay loop and storytelling style would be insane. It already felt like a roguelite, but without a gameplay or narrative reason to go in for multiple runs.
Supergiant hasn't cought a roguelite bug... They've found the perfect narrative and game format to match the gameplay systems and worlds they like to create.
Bastion is an absolute stinker of a game.
It's completely pedestrian, and there are so many bad design decisions it's hard to even take it seriously.
It's a game where marketing really did its job because the game could never carry itself based on its presentation or mechanics.
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Bastion is an absolute stinker of a game.
It's completely pedestrian, and there are so many bad design decisions it's hard to even take it seriously.
It's a game where marketing really did its job because the game could never carry itself based on its presentation or mechanics.
It was really groundbreaking to have the narrator react to what you were doing, in a "Half-Life feels like a real world that you inhabit" way. The way the music was woven into the game was also amazing, and the art! There's a reason it put them on the map.
I didn't like the gameplay all that much though and the world building didn't make too much sense to me. These parts have aged the most poorly. But it was way better than just marketing.
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To be honest, I get what you're saying here although I've played all their games. I think of the bunch I disliked Bastion the most. It felt like an empty PSX game. I liked Transistor, but the catch is that it needed to be played pretty much surrounding their pause-the-battle technique which was okay but it really kind of sucks to me whenever I have any game use this technique. I would have much rather it had been a full turn-based game. I like turn-based games though. There is some viking game that plays like a janky-table top where it's semi-turnbased and it was absolutely awful for it.
Mind you, I like Transistor due to its story. Which I think is the same reason why I liked Pyre. The setting, it was quite nice and if I could remove the mini-games from the game I would. Hades, I liked because they took characters the size of tic-tacs and turned them into three-dimensional beings. That was quite nice. They played on a lot of anime tropes. The gameplay was good, but it was a bit too challenging for me. I dropped it relatively early due to this. I pretty much sit in the same camp now. I wondered if maybe I had aged out of their target audience but I will probably never play one of their games again. It's just not my bag.
Hades was really hard for me too, and I played upwards of 100+ runs before beating [redacted], and another bunch before finally turning on God mode, where I think I got up to about 20% damage reduction before it stabilized.
At this point I want to push the story forward (I'm in the epilogue) but I've already played so much I need to wait more for the battling to be fun again.
